Transcript

PID283 – November 14, 2025

00:00:00 AJ: Everyone welcome once again to Podcast In Depth, the weekly podcast where we discuss the In depth series of books by J.D. Robb. I am A.J..

00:00:25 Tara: I’m Tara.

00:00:26 AJ: In this episode two hundred eighty two of podcast in depth, I think, is this tweet. This is two eighty, is it? I might be wrong about that. Well, I think.

00:00:40 Tara: It’s two eighty something.

00:00:42 AJ: It is two eighty something.

00:00:44 Tara: Because I just listened to the last episode. It’s a two eighty three, two eighty three. Wow.

00:00:52 AJ: There you go. That’s how much we paid attention. Um, and in this episode, we are going to talk about secrets in death.

00:01:04 Tara: Secrets and death, which I had kind of forgotten. A lot of.

00:01:07 AJ: Yeah. Oh, by.

00:01:08 Tara: The way, I ended up enjoying it. Yes.

00:01:10 AJ: Did you hear Caitlin’s, uh, comment about when I told her what secrets and death was about?

00:01:16 Tara: Yes, I did. And I agree. So Caitlin has said, if you listen to last week’s episode that, um, Lorinda mars was, uh. She didn’t. You didn’t tell her that was her name, but, uh, Lorinda Mars was kind of a Rita Skeeter and I. I definitely like it’s the same vibe. And at the end of the day, it’s, like, really, really insincere. Not a good person. Um, also reporting and sharing fact sharing things. Not facts, but sharing things with the wider world. Um, so yes, she, uh, got that one spot on without reading the book. But you know what else she said? She also said that she was talking about, um, how she dreads reading the fifth book. Um, every time she does a reread. And, um, as someone who spent the last five years reading these books so, so, so closely, sorry, you guys are getting a little bit of a Harry Potter thing. Um, I really, really, really recommend to Caitlin and anyone who’s doing a reread of the Harry Potter series, especially in the fifth book, to spend some time really analyzing what is going on in a fifteen year old boy’s life, who has gone through major trauma and is trying to also navigate his life. And when you read it in a condensed fashion, that’s I mean, that’s how books are meant to be read. But I found that I really enjoyed that book so much more when I was really, really tearing it to pieces, trying to get everything I could out of it. It didn’t work for Adam, though. He hates that book, so that doesn’t necessarily mean it’s gonna work for.

00:02:55 AJ: Everyone.

00:02:56 Tara: But he hates that book because of Umbridge.

00:02:58 AJ: Yeah. Um, but that’s happened on this show, too. I mean, I really disliked, um, uh, possession when I read it again. Critically or analytically for this show. It’s actually a really good book, you know.

00:03:17 Tara: Except for the possession part.

00:03:18 AJ: Except for the possession. And it’s like, not like the possession is bad. I just didn’t feel like, you know, my thoughts on it. Like you can’t have Eve be possessed and then a book later, she’s still like, I don’t know about woo woo stuff. And even, dude, you’ve been possessed. So like, you can’t. That didn’t make sense to me. That was the disconnect. So but other than that, it was it was still a great book. Yeah. You need to settle. Not you. The only thing.

00:03:49 Tara: I also need to settle.

00:03:50 AJ: But you need to settle that. Sure.

00:03:53 Tara: Um, the one thing I did because you were like, Tara’s gonna have a lot, a lot to say about this episode, and I do. It was a wonderful episode. The only thing I would like to tack on to that is that what I love most about this series is reading the books again and getting more out of them when I’m like, oh, I didn’t recall liking this one very much because there’s always something. There’s always something in every book that makes me go, oh my God, I really liked that scene between Eve and Peabody, or I really liked that, uh, witness that, you know, like, was super strong and a terrible woman or there was a really sweet work moment, like. Or a really funny Galahad trying to steal food, like there’s always something, right? Even in the books that were like, uh, overall, you know, and that’s, that’s the charm of this series. And is there less of that in the latter half of the series than the first half of the series? I do I do think part of that comes with the repetition that we’ve had in the first half of the series. Yeah. So so and I and I’ve realized that recently, as when I was reading this book, I was like, I did not remember this book as well. And so then I was like, hmm, maybe I don’t like it as much or whatever, but I’m like, no, I just haven’t read it as much.

00:05:07 AJ: Yeah, I had the opposite reaction because I hadn’t read it as much either. And and when I was reading it for this episode, um, I realized how much I liked it. Like, I really, really liked this book a lot.

00:05:21 Tara: I did too. I liked it, I, um, I just forgotten it.

00:05:25 AJ: Yeah. Oh, yeah, I well, I remembered different parts of it, like, oh, I don’t I totally remember this part. The first part, especially when she goes to have drinks with Dewinter. Oh yeah.

00:05:37 Tara: That was like, maybe the only part I remembered.

00:05:39 AJ: Yeah, that’s what I remembered, mostly, but, um. But yeah, I ended up really, really, really liking this one this time around.

00:05:47 Tara: Yeah, this was a this was a nice and it wasn’t. And it’s not I mean, in some places it is kind of a heavier read, but in other places it’s not. Yeah, it’s a nice mid when when I say mid I don’t mean like mid like the youths mean mid right.

00:06:04 AJ: The youths.

00:06:05 Tara: The youths.

00:06:08 AJ: So yeah. So let’s talk about theme. Let’s just move on to the theme because um clearly the book is about secrets. I mean obviously right.

00:06:18 Tara: Yes.

00:06:19 AJ: Um, on a, on a deeper level it could be about a lot of things, deception. And what’s the word, somebody wanting to hide themselves or reinvent themselves or not being truthful about what. And it’s kind of ironic that I say that because ultimately I decided that, um, the theme here is truth.

00:06:44 Tara: Okay, I like that.

00:06:46 AJ: Um, or lies, truth and lies, but mostly about truth. And the reason I settled on that was, you know, I look at things that are not associated with the case, right? Right. And but, you know, even the even the case, all of the things that Lauren and Morris had on people were their truths that they’ve been trying to hide. Yeah. Um, and, uh, but when you look at the other things that happen in this book, first chapter, uh, even the winter meet, because, you know, Eve’s promised to do that. And when you think about it, they’re really there to to kind of figure out the truth of each other. You know.

00:07:31 Tara: That’s a good point. That’s a good point.

00:07:32 AJ: De Winter knows Eve doesn’t like her. She wants to know the truth about why. And when they talking about that, at a certain point, the subject of, um. Morris comes up.

00:07:43 Tara: Yes.

00:07:44 AJ: And, uh, de Winter says to Eve at at that point, I didn’t know Amaryllis, but I do know Lee loved her. Loved her deeply. You know about loving deeply. And you know how the loss of her leveled him. You were there for him when it did. You’re still there for him. And it says Eve knew the sound of bullshit. And she knew the sound of truth. What she heard was truth. It loosened her stiffened spine. So it. I love how Nora says stuff like that, you know. Um, her. It loosened her stiffened spine. The truth about the about what de Winter said kind of made Eve go like, oh, okay, this is this is a person that understands. And that that made Eve feel better about her.

00:08:36 Tara: It’s a very good, like choice of this being the conversation that they have. There’s no bullshit. There’s no, like, tiptoeing around anything in their conversation at all. And so like, yes, we know Eve is like, I don’t bullshit, I don’t small talk. That’s shitty. You know, I don’t do that. But like you also and I think we talked about it before Winter and Eve actually have some of some very similar, you know, personality traits going on here.

00:09:07 AJ: Yes.

00:09:08 Tara: And it’s one hundred percent clear in this moment, in this scene. And, you know, and I just I think it’s such a good way to have Nora bring the winter into the series as no longer a potential antagonistic, uh, like, I don’t know, field around Eve because it wasn’t like she was like, she didn’t she wasn’t like, I hate this woman. But she was like, I don’t like her. And she realizes that, like, she’s she’s kind of being silly for not liking this woman because she doesn’t actually know her. And she does it so splendidly. She’s like. And then also the murder is going to happen in the scene. So we’re just gonna make this nice and easy. Good job. Nora.

00:09:55 AJ: She knows what she’s doing.

00:09:57 Tara: She sure do.

00:09:59 AJ: Um, so. And then it, uh. But the thing is, like, it’s loosened Eve’s spine, but not enough. Like, it’s the same kind of thing with Somerset, right? We all know that she. She cares for Somerset, but she’s still got that, you know, she still wants to poke the bear and stuff, you know, because that’s just how they are together. And her and de Winter is the same. We’re not going to go to some like situation where she’s suddenly, you know, de Winter is her best friend in the world.

00:10:34 Tara: No, but.

00:10:36 AJ: But we know this is kind of signaling to us that she is already starting to soften toward de winter, Like Somerset. Even if she’s. If even if we’re not going to see it outright, we know that that’s already starting to happen.

00:10:51 Tara: Yeah. She’s just never going to talk about it.

00:10:53 AJ: Right.

00:10:54 Tara: Um.

00:10:55 AJ: Then later on in the book, um, even talking about the people they both came from, there was a discussion about why Roarke built the house the way that he did, and he said it was because of Somerset. You know, partially. And they had this whole discussion about how Somerset made him read and blah, blah, blah. So during that discussion, Roarke says to her, Somerset was right. It matters who and what we came from. And it says he felt her stiffen, saw her eyes go flat. It matters to Eve that you came from monsters matters, he continued, gripping her chin in his hand. Because coming from them, you chose to make yourself into a woman who hunts those monsters not for vengeance, as would surely have been my choice, but for justice. I built a house. You built a hero. And Eve says, I built a cop, she corrected, relaxing again.

00:11:52 Tara: That’s our Eve.

00:11:53 AJ: Yeah, right. I had some help there. Same as you. And you don’t give me hours of your time on an investigation for vengeance? If we don’t always toe the same line on justice, we do on truth. And you work with me for truth. And then it says. His eyes stayed warm on hers as he skimmed his thumb over the shallow dent in her chin. It wouldn’t have been my choice once. But when I met you and loved you, and things changed, like summer in February. Another truth she knew, and it touched her. But she poked a finger in his belly. Making it sound poetic. Doesn’t change how it screwed up. And yet he kissed her. We have pie because. But right before this Somerset something said something about having apple pie, and he got apples from New Zealand. And she’s like, It’s February in New Zealand too. Like, why would it? And it’s like, but it’s summertime even though it’s February. And she started complaining about that. And that’s why she said this whole thing about it’s summer in February because she makes this whole thing about, you know, freaking February and how everybody just wants to get it over with.

00:13:09 Tara: Which is fair. Sorry. People born in February.

00:13:13 AJ: Uh. It’s stupid. No wonder people are perpetually fucked up, as nobody can depend on something as basic as February, which is already screwed up because it insists on having less days than adding one like a little prize every four years, even though everybody wants February to get the hell over so we can move on. So, um, so that’s why she says, you know, making it sound poetic doesn’t change how it screwed up. And he says. And yet we have pie. So anyway, um, we’ll probably talk more about truths and whatnot as we go along, but that is my, uh, choice for the theme for this.

00:13:58 Tara: I love it. I think it’s great. I agree, because you know me, I don’t even try to think of a theme because I.

00:14:05 AJ: Know that’s my.

00:14:05 Tara: Job. That’s your job? Yeah. Like, why would I do a job that’s that’s literally like the opposite of efficiency. Doing a job that, like, is already being done.

00:14:15 AJ: Okay, exactly.

00:14:16 Tara: Um, not that I’m known for being the most efficient person, but when I know that there’s an efficiency option, we’re going to go with it.

00:14:23 AJ: Well, and what your job is to do is to go like, oh, yeah, that sounds good. And here’s why that makes sense to me as well. That’s your job.

00:14:32 Tara: Yes. So it’s the easier job.

00:14:36 AJ: Um, and.

00:14:37 Tara: If you ever notice, I do the easier jobs around here?

00:14:42 AJ: You do, but, you know, that’s fine. It’s really. It’s it’s your job is not so easy because as I said on the episode last week, if you were there, you would probably have a lot more insightful things to say. So your job is to be insightful and that is not easy.

00:15:04 Tara: I try, I don’t necessarily think I’m any more insightful than you are, but I think we’re a good team, so.

00:15:11 AJ: All right, there we go. So your job is also to read day one in this chapter.

00:15:19 Tara: One day, one day one. Tuesday chapter one. Eve is already cranky because she promised Garnet Dewinter, uh, that she would meet her for drinks, and she’d honestly rather tackle a zoo stuffed cami head than hang out in a fancy bar. But a deal’s a deal, so she sucks it up and shows up at duvan. How did how did Susan pronounce that? Duvan.

00:15:43 AJ: Yeah. Diovan. Diovan. I don’t know.

00:15:47 Tara: Duvan. Duvan. Listen, it’s French and I don’t. I don’t speak French.

00:15:51 AJ: And neither does even when I does Eve. But Dr. Winter does. And that’s one of the things that bothers Eve about de Winter. Since we’re talking about it.

00:16:00 Tara: Which, by the way, Roarke owns this place because of Roarke. Because Roarke. Yeah, right. Of course he does. So while she’s there, Eve sees gossip columnist Laurinda Mars, and she is glad Mars does not see her.

00:16:15 AJ: I mean.

00:16:16 Tara: Which is fair. And, um. So she and Dr. Winter trade some verbal jabs over wine until de Winter basically calls Eve a rude, single minded, hard ass, single minded hard ass. And Eve fires back that de winter’s a snob with a PhD ego. Yikes. All right, so this is from the book. Um, okay. Eve drank a little wine. Considered, I don’t know you. And what I do know, I don’t really get you strike me as a snob. And one with her own tight ass who’s plenty puffed up about all the letters after her name. Which is such a rude, rude thing to say. People are hard for those letters. Like okay, winters do. Winters back went up like a bright red flag. I’m not a snob. What’s that thing you’re drinking? That thing that you named with a snooty French accent. I like this drink, and I speak French. That doesn’t make me a snob. Amused. Now, who knew that was all it took to get under winters skin? Eve plowed on. And you? What’s the word swirl around in your coordinated outfits?

00:17:24 AJ: Eve? Come on.

00:17:26 Tara: You’re wearing six thousand dollars boots. I am not appalled. Eve struck one foot out, stared. God, she probably was. The difference is, I wouldn’t have a clue how much your boots cost. Only that nobody with any sense would wear them when they’re going to stand on them for hours at a time. Dr. winters face, her voice registered absolute astonishment. Your problem with me is how I dress. It’s systemic. Cited on the spot. Systemic my ass. To winter. Wagged a straw at Eve before crushing, crunching it. You have formed an opinion of me on a surface appearance. And you’re a better cop than that. Yeah, I was cheering to winter on during this convo. I love you, but. And Eve, you are too quick to preen in front of the cameras. I don’t preen, and that’s rich coming from you. And one of your closest friends is a reporter, and you get plenty of screen time when it’s advantageous, when it’s advantageous to to an investigation. She wrote a damn book about you. That’s Eve’s line out. Kind of milled together. Um. That’s okay. And she wrote a damn book about you and the vid opted from it is up for Oscars. No, she wrote a damn book about the I coves. Eve held up her hand. You stole a dog.

00:18:43 AJ: Eve.

00:18:44 Tara: There it is. Oh, for Christ’s sake, you stole a dog, Eve continued, because it was being neglected and abused, and nobody else would do anything about it. You kept the dog. I believe in serve and protect. And when somebody, even a dog, is being abused, somebody needs to stop it. You did. That’s a point for you, my dogs, a point for me. I miss you so much.

00:19:08 AJ: I know.

00:19:08 Tara: Yeah. And maybe Morris has shifted to the other side. Because I know when somebody is bullshitting me and you’re not, and you’ve been good for him. When I look at it at him, I’m not going to say otherwise. He’s steadier. And maybe part of that is having you to hang with. I care about him. I got that doesn’t make you less of a snob or media hound, but I got that on a huff. De Winter sat back again. I swear to God, here and now I don’t know why I half like you. Back at you. Since I figure half is good enough. That should do. I need to get home. It is such a good scene.

00:19:48 AJ: Right?

00:19:49 Tara: And what I love about de Winter, of course, is that she is like, yeah, I don’t fucking care. I’m just gonna say what I’m saying. So I’m gonna throw some of that Eve Dallas back at Eve Dallas.

00:20:01 AJ: And.

00:20:02 Tara: She.

00:20:02 AJ: Exactly. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, there’s a lot of truth here that de Winter is giving to Eve.

00:20:12 Tara: Oh, yeah.

00:20:13 AJ: You know, she.

00:20:13 Tara: She’s throwing that out. She does not care. And then, um, so so as according to this scene we just read, it’s actually going okay ish until Eve sees Laurinda Mars staggering through the bar, bleeding out all over the floor. Just a normal day. And he’s.

00:20:32 AJ: Like.

00:20:32 Tara: Um. And Eve jumps straight into cop mode and runs to try to help her. Dwayne’s her follows, and Lorinda dies. Anyway. Eve locks down the bar and starts taking witness statements while waiting for backup. So not a good day for Lorinda mars?

00:20:48 AJ: No. No.

00:20:51 Tara: So that was chapter one.

00:20:54 AJ: Yeah.

00:20:55 Tara: Would you like me to continue with chapter two?

00:20:57 AJ: Uh, up to you.

00:20:59 Tara: Okay, I will do chapter two, and then I’ll probably make you do chapter three.

00:21:03 AJ: Okay.

00:21:05 Tara: Chapter two. The scene is a mess as it is a bar and there is blood. But even Peabody figure out that Mars was stabbed in the arm. A clean, fast kill from someone who knew exactly what they were doing. Mars had a panic button, pepper spray, and even an illegal stunner in her purse, but never reached for any of it, which tells Eve the killer wasn’t a stranger. She calls Rorke to tell him she’s going to be late because she met Dewinter at one of his bars, and now he’s caught a case. He is sorry. She caught a case and asked her how she likes the bar. She replies that she literally caught a case in his bar. The smile. This is from the book. Sorry. The smile vanished. Those bold blue eyes turned cool. There’s been a murder in my place. I’m down in the women’s bathroom. You’re going to have to repaint the walls, Eve. I’m on my way. Right. She’s like. She’s like. So, um, this place is a fucking ass walk. Like, you know why you paint these walls? What a thing to say. She was like, you’re gonna have to paint the walls. Uh, it’s like I imagine her just walking in. Yeah. Hey, Roark. Listen, I gotta tell you some stuff. I caught a case, and we’re like, huh? That sounds normal. Sounds like whatever. Uh, it’s at your bar. Really? Are you fucking kidding me? Yeah. You got to repaint the walls, my guy. Like. Stop by Sherwin-Williams on your way. Yeah. Um, so, anyway, Roark is still in this in the scene. Roark says, I’m on my way. And Eve says, I’m going to say, for form, there’s no need for you to come here. But you don’t need to say for form. Why? Why there is. I’ll see you when you get here. Sorry, so am I. I like that also. This happens. This has happened more and more recently. Um, that Eva’s like. Yes, I know you’re going to come anyway, and I’m just gonna. I have to say it like I have to say it. No one can say. I didn’t say it. I just love it. I’m just gonna deal. Yeah. So. So that’s the end of that scene. And then Roark shows up a little while later to help with security feeds while Eve interviews staff. And then they learn that Mars dinner date was a guy named Fabio Bellamy, which is such a name. And even Roarke head out to have a little chat with him, which is fun. Yep. All right, so chapter four at Mars’s fancy apartment. Eve knows it’s not Roarke owned because it’s ugly. And Roarke wouldn’t own an ugly apartment building. Building? Uh, Eve sees how shallow Linda’s life really was. Beautiful space, zero warmth. The staff hated her. And her neighbors weren’t fans, either. One of the staff tells Eve that they think Lorinda was dating Mitch Elder. And so this is Eve. Come on. Right. Um, this is Eve saying, talking to Roarke. I’ll have to do a run on this Mitchell Day, have a chat with him. And Roarke says that’s Mitch. L initial l day. Seriously? Roarke nodded as the elevator doors opened. He hosts a late morning talk show. Mystified, Eve shook her head. Why do people want to? Why do people watch shows where other people sit around and talk? There are some that who actually enjoy conversations. I know that’s a shock to you. If you’re watching on screen, you’re not even having a conversation. You’re more eavesdropping. She pulled out, her master, frowning. Consideration. Huh? Okay, I get that. Of course you do, right?

00:25:01 Speaker 3: I know, like he was actually eavesdropping. Sounds great. Right? Because even secretly, he knows he is. Fuck. Obviously. Yeah.

00:25:10 Tara: Yeah. Um. And then she says, aren’t Eve’s the thing? The things on the sides of buildings. How do you drop them? And what does that have to do with listening in on other people’s conversations? He drew a blank, found himself intrigued. I’ll be sure to look it up. Language which conversations are made of doesn’t make any sense half the time.

00:25:33 Speaker 3: I would just like to say it was during this read of this book that I was like, I have decided that every time Eve does this, I’m I’m I give her kudos. Because you know what? Don’t the rest of us go off on tangents about shit that doesn’t make sense? And Eve knows exactly what she’s doing. She knows exactly what she’s doing. She like she gets she’s she like, is in the rhythm of the conversation. And she’s like, oh yeah, that’s another one. And I’m just going to rip that apart right now because it doesn’t fucking make sense. And I’m like, yes, you are correct. I’m not going to focus on it in my regular everyday life, but when I read it in these books, I fucking love it. And I really, I think also this book just had so many fucking laugh out loud moments.

00:26:17 Tara: Yeah, it really did. Yeah, that’s one of the reasons why.

00:26:19 Speaker 3: I like this.

00:26:19 Tara: one.

00:26:20 Speaker 3: This one, I was like. I was like at first I was like, oh. Eavesdropping. Haha. Whatever. And I was like. Actually, good for you that you are like, add enough that you just stop and love what you’re saying. You’re like, what? Why are we using this fucking expression? It’s so dumb.

00:26:36 Tara: Sometimes you hear a phrase and.

00:26:38 Speaker 3: You’re.

00:26:38 Tara: Like, you’re like, where the hell did that phrase come from? Why am I even saying it? Like, it doesn’t make sense. So she’s correct.

00:26:46 Speaker 3: So great.

00:26:46 Tara: You know what she’s.

00:26:47 Speaker 3: Doing here.

00:26:48 Tara: Tara? She’s telling the truth.

00:26:52 Speaker 3: Right?

00:26:53 Tara: Yes.

00:26:54 Speaker 3: She sure is. It’s. The truth is, this doesn’t fucking make sense.

00:26:58 Tara: Doesn’t fucking make sense.

00:26:58 Speaker 3: This is our.

00:26:59 Tara: Theme. She’s right. So, uh, Roarke helps. Eve opened Ma’s safe, which is stuffed with a about a million in cash and jewelry. Uh, big surprise. Blackmail paid. Well, Ed confirms what Eve already suspects. Mars has been running an extensive extortion racket Eve takes the safe back to central to dig deeper.

00:27:23 Speaker 3: What a stand up one hundred percent.

00:27:25 Tara: Eve is not taking that safe. So one of the things that, like I found myself doing because I worked for fifteen years for a safe company, anytime they mentioned a safe, like, uh, like Rorke opening the safe and stuff. And I’m like, well, that’s not really how you do that, but okay. Um, and them saying like, well, we’re just we’ll take this safe back to central, like, well, then they better have a crew or something, because some of those safes, even the small ones, are fucking heavy. It’s not like Rorke can say, like, well, I’ll just pick it up and take it to the car.

00:27:59 Speaker 3: Right.

00:28:00 Tara: You have to have somebody. And a lot of times they’re, um, bolted into the floor. So, uh, if you really anybody out there that has a safe, a big safe that has a lot of, like, million dollars in it, like Lorinda Morris had and a bunch of jewelry, it better be bolted to the floor. I’m just telling you right now.

00:28:19 Speaker 3: Otherwise, what the fuck is the point?

00:28:21 Tara: Right. So, um.

00:28:24 Speaker 3: I thought on it. Anyway, I am really surprised. I feel like this is. Maybe it’s not the first time you’ve mentioned when you worked for the same company on this podcast. I did know this at one point. You did say it, whether it was on the podcast or just in general, but I’m surprised this is the first time that you have made that comment that, no, you’re not taking that safe with you. Promise?

00:28:49 Tara: Well, I don’t remember them them taking a safe.

00:28:52 Speaker 3: I now that I’m thinking about it, I don’t know that I do either, because I feel like there’s a fuck ton of safes that get opened in this series.

00:28:59 Tara: Before he’s open safes before, but they’ve been small and this sounded like it was big. And there’s going to be another safe later on in this series that they talk about, like he and McNabb, like, have a McNabb practically have an orgasm over this safe, right? Um, and like that. That one for sure. I mean, it was saying a bunch of things, like how many bolts it had, and I was like.

00:29:27 Speaker 3: Yeah, you guys are taking a safe.

00:29:29 Tara: I don’t think it has that many bolts. I don’t think that’s possible, but maybe I don’t know.

00:29:35 Speaker 3: You know, obviously Nora’s not a safe expert, but we love her anyway.

00:29:40 Tara: She could have just called me. I was working, I, I think I was working at the safe company when this book came out, I don’t know. Um, anyway, so chapter five, we’re on chapter five.

00:29:54 Speaker 3: Yes.

00:29:55 Tara: To read that.

00:29:56 Speaker 3: Um, sure. Unless you want me to.

00:29:59 Tara: Um.

00:30:00 Speaker 3: Read chapter five.

00:30:01 Tara: first. Like you. You read like.

00:30:03 Speaker 3: Yeah.

00:30:04 Tara: One and two and three.

00:30:05 Speaker 3: I read that one. Okay.

00:30:08 Tara: Um. Chapter five. Uh, back home, Eve sets up her murder board and goes over security footage. She spots a mystery man who slips out of Duvan duvan. However, uh, Susan Erikson says that right before Mars died. Yeah, he he’s just slightly apart from his group keeping his head down. Definitely suspicious. Uh, between bites of apple pie and Eve freaking out over the possibility that Somerset will probably be having sex while on vacation. Even Roarke analyzed receipts and Mars’s finances. Turns out Lorinda was loaded with multiple secret accounts worth millions. The woman lived big off other people’s secrets.

00:30:52 Speaker 3: Do you think Somerset was having sex on this vacation?

00:30:56 Tara: Well, yes.

00:30:59 Speaker 3: Okay.

00:30:59 Tara: You don’t think so?

00:31:00 Speaker 3: I was talking.

00:31:01 Tara: About was, oh, he’s going on vacation. And Roarke says. And then they will be going to. And he’s like, wait a minute, they. And he says, yeah, he and Ivana.

00:31:11 Speaker 3: Ivana. Ivana.

00:31:12 Tara: But how old is he by this time? How old do we say decide he was?

00:31:17 Speaker 3: Oh.

00:31:18 Tara: Like in his, like sixties.

00:31:20 Speaker 3: Seventies? I don’t care. It’s not because I don’t think Somerset’s having sex at seventy. Um, it’s I wasn’t I wasn’t sure that I decided that I like, now that we’ve read bonded. I don’t know that I’m like, are they together or are they now? Are they just like, very, very close friends? I mean, if they are.

00:31:42 Tara: Definitely together because they were together when they were younger, and I think that’s what they were talking about, like they were together when they were younger, and then they kind of went their separate ways and they each.

00:31:51 Speaker 3: Had different lives. Yeah.

00:31:53 Tara: That’s and then they met up again and started up the, the relationship. And to me that sounded like that was, you know.

00:32:01 Speaker 3: Yeah, I guess I didn’t I didn’t realize that they had started their relationship back up, but that makes sense and honestly have as much sex as you want. Somerset. Fuck. Eve, right? She’s just.

00:32:10 Tara: Weird. No, don’t fuck eat. But have as much as you. Yes, you.

00:32:15 Speaker 3: Know.

00:32:15 Tara: What I mean.

00:32:16 Speaker 3: You know what I mean. And also, like Eve is way too worried about what other people are doing.

00:32:22 Tara: Right?

00:32:23 Speaker 3: I love you, Eve. But, like. Stop.

00:32:26 Tara: Right?

00:32:27 Speaker 3: You do this to yourself. You cannot be mad at Roark for bringing up Somerset, going on vacation with a woman and be like, oh my God, I can’t think about him having sex.

00:32:34 Tara: And then she just obsessed about it.

00:32:36 Speaker 3: Went there.

00:32:36 Tara: Yeah. And then she’s obsessed about it. And then Roark was like, well, now all this talk about him having sex is putting me off my pie. And work was.

00:32:45 Speaker 3: Perfectly, perfectly content to just fucking eat pie, Eve. And you had to go there.

00:32:50 Tara: Because Roark can compartmentalize that. I mean, I think someplace in his mind he knows that they’re having sex together, but it’s not like Eve is like every thought that Eve has is like front and center and right. But Roark can compartmentalize. And like, that was way back here in his head, and he didn’t have to think about it until she started.

00:33:09 Speaker 3: He was like, why did you take that out?

00:33:11 Tara: Yes.

00:33:12 Speaker 3: I told you to keep that put away. Put that back away. But you know what? But you know what? Feeny does it to Feeny is like Eve. Yes, because they. He and Eve are weird about Peabody McNabb. They are two human beings who are in a relationship. What do you think they’re doing? What do you think they’re doing? Yeah, you know what they’re doing? Because Peabody is like, yeah, I’m going to harass Eve about this, haha. But like, there’s it’s so funny. It’s so funny. In this moment, I just again, I was like, whatever. Because I was not thinking about them being in a relationship, but I fucking think it’s hilarious.

00:33:47 Tara: It’s hilarious. Yeah.

00:33:49 Speaker 3: He was like, why are you thinking about that, Eve? Does she think about her other friends? Other people are like, does she think about them?

00:33:57 Tara: She thinks about everybody having sex. She she’s grossed out by everybody else having sex. And I don’t know why. That’s why. She talks about Charles and Louise and she talks about.

00:34:08 Speaker 3: Because she’s like, how could she be with him? Because he’s a licensed companion? Yeah, don’t worry about it. Don’t worry about anyone else.

00:34:15 Tara: Yeah, I think she had to think about it. When was it in seduction? When she called Feenie member, and it was like a video call. And he was wearing, like, her pajamas because it was Valentine’s Day. She. I think she’s.

00:34:29 Speaker 3: Like, oh, my God, I can’t do this.

00:34:31 Tara: She just. Yeah, she she thinks too much about other people having sex and not in the way that like it’s perverted in the way that like, is prudish kind of. Yeah.

00:34:39 Speaker 3: Yeah.

00:34:41 Tara: Yeah.

00:34:42 Speaker 3: Which is, which is also not productive.

00:34:45 Tara: No.

00:34:46 Speaker 3: But we love her very much.

00:34:47 Tara: Yes.

00:34:48 Speaker 3: So, um, anyway, um, I can read chapter six.

00:34:53 Tara: Yeah.

00:34:54 Speaker 3: So chapter six. So Eve sums it up nicely. Mars blackmailed the wrong person, and someone finally decided that they’d had enough work. Casually drops that Mars once tried to blackmail him, too. He handled it by scaring the life out of her. Naturally. Because Scary Roarke is great, right? So this is from the book. Eve. Relaxed. You went scary Roarke on her. He tapped Eve lightly between the eyes. I was remarkably pleasant. Scary, Roarke. Eve repeated. I asked if she enjoyed her work, to which she rather smugly assured me she did. Adding that she was very good at it. So I simply outlined a hypothetical. What would she what did she think might happen to her own career if I were to have a whim? And by channel seventy five, Eve let out a half laugh. Perfect. It would be an interesting acquisition. How easy it would be. Should I be interested enough to do so? To break her current contract and plant seeds that would root in such a way that she’d be fortunate to find a job as a gofer in a broadcasting in some third rate station in Bumfuck. You said Bumfuck. To the best of my recollection, I explained, my interest would definitely peak if the right person and I knew so many people whispered in my ear that she was scratching about in my business or my bride to be’s. She could hear him say it all in the brutally cold and pleasant tone he could whip out like a deadly weapon. Did she piss herself? I couldn’t say, but she did leave rather abruptly. I kept a few ears out for a space of time and she opted not to scratch about. So that was the end of that. A single and brief conversation nearly three years ago. Such a good moment.

00:36:39 Tara: She. Yeah. He’s so great at scary work.

00:36:43 Speaker 3: Love. Scary work. So then they end the night the way that even Roarke usually do, a mix of dark humor, sexy banter, and a solid understanding that between his reformed criminal past and her bitch cop presence, they make one hell of a team. And they do the thing.

00:37:00 Tara: They do the thing.

00:37:01 Speaker 3: They do the thing. So that is the first day.

00:37:05 Tara: Yeah.

00:37:06 Speaker 3: Which which, by the way, is not even a whole day. It starts at the end of the day, right?

00:37:12 Tara: Yeah, it’s a lot. It’s like six chapters of half a day of.

00:37:16 Speaker 3: Of half a day.

00:37:18 Tara: Yeah.

00:37:18 Speaker 3: Wednesday, day two, chapter seven. So Eve starts her morning with waffles. Her prize for surviving the previous day. Agreed. You earned those waffles, Eve. And a little guilt over wearing expensive boots to the morgue. Morris confirms Ma’s killer used a scalpel and hit a major artery. Fast and intentional. Oh, and Ma’s was actually pushing fifty, not thirty seven, thanks to a laundry list of cosmetic surgeries. Um, Peabody and McNab are fired from working on Mars tech. But because he’s also been working other cases there that are just as complicated, McNab is especially wiped. Peabody talks about scraping some money together to afford a vacation somewhere warm. After thinking about it for half a second, Eve. States that Mexico is warm and suggests that Peabody and McNab used Works villa for a week. And Peabody is stunned than excited enough to hug Eve. But she doesn’t because she knows better. And then she says a very sincere thank you. At sensual, Eve interviews the bar staff from Devon. The waitress remembers a guy sitting alone, head down, gloves on, paying cash. Basically the human version of suspicious. Unfortunately, not enough detail for an I.D.. Yes. So in that chapter, we get a lot of fun stuff.

00:38:39 Tara: Yeah. And the whole Eve offering them, you know, the use of the villa in Mexico was really nice. It was a really nice moment. You know.

00:38:50 Speaker 3: I love it. Um, it’s another reminder that Eve is not a heartless bitch. Um.

00:38:56 Tara: Right.

00:38:56 Speaker 3: It’s also a nice moment where Nora, like, pushes in there that all the people who think that Peabody is a mooch off of her partner like that, Nora reminds us that she’s not. And she’s.

00:39:09 Tara: Like.

00:39:10 Speaker 3: Telling Eve because Eve is her partner and probably and next to McNab, the person she spends the most of her time with. Um, I’m gonna do this thing for my partner. Who? Whose or my boyfriend? Who is, you know, not doing great. And, uh, I just need you to know, because you’re my boss, and I’m going to take some time off. And that is not her trying to get anything. And it’s a beautiful moment. And then Eve is like, how about we do this? And it’s again, it’s one of those things where I’m just like, yay, look at Eve being Eve who is. Eve is like the most empathetic and like, generous person.

00:39:51 Tara: Yeah.

00:39:52 Speaker 3: In just just in just a naive way. It’s just an Eve way.

00:39:56 Tara: Right.

00:39:56 Speaker 3: You know. Yeah. So so that’s I think.

00:39:59 Tara: It’s funny that. Yeah. So they’re having this conversation and and Peabody does say to her like, um, you know, it’s a, it’s a mega deal. It’s a mango mega deal. Big giant gratitude. But I wasn’t fishing for a freebie. We’ve got some saved. And he says, I know you weren’t fishing. You didn’t have your fishing face on. And she’s like, I don’t have a fishing face. You have a fishing face. Eve did her best to mimic it with big, innocent puppy eyes, a shy, winsome smile. I absolutely don’t make that face. You do when you’re fishing.

00:40:35 Speaker 3: It’s so good.

00:40:37 Tara: Yeah.

00:40:37 Speaker 3: And whenever and so like, because people, you know, might be like, well, you’ve just said she does okay. Like that’s when Peabody is like, hey, can we eat fucking lunch? Right. That’s not for something big like that. Yeah. It’s never like, can you give gift me a vacation to your island? Like it’s it’s. Can we eat lunch today? That is what we want to use. Or at the very most, it’ll be like, well, if, um, we have the briefing at your house, we can all eat for the day.

00:41:10 Tara: Right? Yeah.

00:41:12 Speaker 3: Like, okay, that’s not the same as her expecting things from even Roark. Like some some of the reviewers say give the girl a break. I also really love the, um, this last paragraph of this, of this chapter, um, summary where it’s like, well, the way it says, the waitress remembers a guy sitting alone, blah, blah, blah, and then like, explains all of the typical suspicious guy shit, head down, wearing gloves, paying cash, like, and I just feel like the tone of the paragraph, the way it’s worded is like. And then we get the guy that we’re not we’re not getting shit from this. We’re not getting shit from this at all. Bless that waitress. She did what she could, Good, right? I love I just love the tone of that little paragraph.

00:42:01 Tara: So are you going to read the next chapter? You want me to read it?

00:42:08 Speaker 3: Do you want me to read it? And then you can read the next one? I guess we’re doing three at a time today. Okay, I love it. Three chapters at a time. Okay. Three is a good number.

00:42:17 Tara: Magic number.

00:42:18 Speaker 3: It’s a magic number. Chapter eight. Eve. Freeze. Commander Whitney, who’s unbothered to hear Mars once again tried blackmailing Roarke, or once tried blackmailing Roarke like he’s like. Of course she did.

00:42:35 Tara: Yeah, of course she did. And what did he do? He kicked her ass. Yeah, okay.

00:42:39 Speaker 3: He’s like, okay.

00:42:40 Tara: That’s right. Move on.

00:42:42 Speaker 3: So Whitney’s main concern is optics. So he loops in media liaison Kyung to coordinate a press plan. They agree that Nadine first gets the first exclusive interview, professional courtesy and all that the other people love that. Anyway, on the tech side, Feeney agrees to help McNabb with Ma’s encrypted files once he’s back from vacation, which just proves how much everyone wants this wrapped up fast. Even Peabody had to channel seventy five to see what Ma’s coworkers have to say. And this is from the book. As she drove to seventy five, Eve ticked off what needed to be done. Peabody run this Mitch l de character. I didn’t get to that on it. As Peabody all but sang the two words, Eve gave her a wary glance. What’s up with you? Just feeling pretty. Mag due to loose pants. Not really any looser, but still loose. And your abso fab offer of Mexico. I’m hitting the shop on my way home tonight and buying this outfit I’ve had my eye on. It’s all flowy and swirly. It’s Mexico. Perfecto. Wow. That’s just the best news ever. Even Eve’s exaggerated sarcasm didn’t dent Peabody’s mood. It has these adorbs little ribbons for straps, so when McNabb tugs them, whoosh! I’m naked! Eve’s eyes went to slits. And this. This is how you repay me? Yes, Eve. Because you. You’re too easy. You’re too easy.

00:44:12 Tara: Right.

00:44:13 Speaker 3: She is also stop thinking about like. This is why Peabody does this. It’s so good.

00:44:19 Tara: Yes.

00:44:21 Speaker 3: It’s so good.

00:44:22 Tara: And the best part is that she doesn’t. You know, Eve is clearly being sarcastic, like, wow, that’s just the best news ever. And she’s, like, completely not fazed by it at all. Yeah, she has these adorbs little ribbons and she.

00:44:34 Speaker 3: And she knows Eve is being sarcastic. She’s like, I’m not. I’m doing my thing. I’m. Yep.

00:44:40 Tara: Yep.

00:44:40 Speaker 3: You you stepped into this Eve. You stepped in because, you know, Peabody was just going to be like, this is great. And then Eve kept going, wow, that’s just the best news ever. And then she’s like, okay, well, now we have to go there.

00:44:53 Tara: Yep. So?

00:44:56 Speaker 3: So fun.

00:44:57 Tara: I was hoping to get some more of these, uh, you know, really fun little quotes into the rest of this chapter. I mean, in the rest of this, um, outline. But then you told me it was, you know, time to record. And I was like, oh, shit, I’m not ready. Um.

00:45:15 Speaker 3: I’m sorry. No, no.

00:45:17 Tara: That’s my.

00:45:18 Speaker 3: Fault. A problem with time zones? Um, we’re like Eve.

00:45:21 Tara: We do one hundred percent.

00:45:23 Speaker 3: Time zones are silly.

00:45:25 Tara: Um, okay, so chapter nine at channel seventy five, it’s all black armbands and fake tears. The boss, BB Hewitt, admits Mars was great for ratings and a nightmare as a person classic. We respected her talent, not her face energy. Eve meets up with Nadine with Trina on Glam Duty, of course. Uh, Trina dishes out how Mars was sneaky, mean and tried to buy her loyalty with gossip about Mavis and Leonardo. Big mistake. Nadine backs it up with receipts. Literally. Uh, playing Eve a recorded a recording where Mars threatened her. Eve’s official interview with Nadine is all business. Mars was targeted, not random. Investigations ongoing. Cops are on it. Off the record, Eve shares the good stuff. Secret accounts, million in cash, a body full of plastic and a long list of enemies. Nadine agrees. Someone finally got sick of paying chapter ten. Next up is Mitch El De channel seventy five resident talk show creep and one of Mars’s flings. He swears he was with a porn star when Mars died. Solid alibi. Really classy.

00:46:40 Speaker 3: You know what? We we we do not shame porn stars or sex workers, but we kind of shame this guy because he sucks.

00:46:47 Tara: Yeah, um, Eve’s not impressed, but it checks out. They also confirm that Mars loved to hoard freebies and push her staff around. No surprise there. Even Peabody then stopped to re-interview witnesses from Duveen. When are we going to stop saying the name of this place? Because.

00:47:05 Speaker 3: Right. Because. Because we don’t know how to pronounce it. Okay.

00:47:10 Tara: Right.

00:47:11 Speaker 3: Um.

00:47:13 Tara: But no one saw the killer. Clearly. You starting to think Mars is plastic? Fake was. And fake charm hid an even faker life. Oh, and Eve dreads her upcoming press conference. Talking to the media is still her least favorite part of the job. Uh, chapter eleven after refueling with a cow burger and fries. Courtesy of Roarke, Eve faces the press with Whitney. Keeps it vague but confident. Back in Ed, Roarke, Feeney and McNab crack part of Mars encryption. A partial list of blackmail targets. Who and two regular meeting spots, Duvan and Gino’s. That’s much easier to say.

00:47:54 Speaker 3: She knows she’s gone there more. I hope we talk.

00:47:57 Tara: About Gino’s more. Yeah. Why couldn’t she have been killed in Gino’s? I don’t understand. Um.

00:48:08 Speaker 3: Because then we wouldn’t have heard about how, uh, winter’s a snob. Because she can speak French.

00:48:14 Tara: Exactly. She knows how to say du vin. Uh, Eve connects the dots and adds a few more names to her growing possible motive list. Uh, Santiago drops by with a heartbreaking case about a teenage girl killing her abuser, which hits Eve right in the gut. It reminds her exactly why she does what she does, and why people like Lauren de Mars piss her off so much.

00:48:39 Speaker 3: Lauren de Mars kind of sucks.

00:48:42 Tara: Yeah.

00:48:43 Speaker 3: Uh, when it’s when it’s someone who sucks, you’re like, okay, but.

00:48:46 Tara: But all of these. Yeah, but all of these people seem like good people. That right?

00:48:52 Speaker 3: Yeah. That she’s been blackmailing? Yeah.

00:48:55 Tara: Yeah. If it was somebody that really sucked, we wouldn’t care. But these are all good people.

00:48:58 Speaker 3: Um, yeah.

00:49:00 Tara: The one I. The thing I wanted. So we’re gonna talk about Wiley, but, um. Uh, because Eve obviously knows who this guy is because he’s, uh. Is he a baseball player? He is a sports ball. Sports.

00:49:14 Speaker 3: He does sports, right? Sports.

00:49:17 Tara: Um. Uh, so she’s at this, um, place that he has, which is like a what is it, a store, but also a gym. And they do, you know, like classes there and whatnot. And it says through a glass wall. She saw a martial arts class performing a pretty decent kata. And on the south side, Stanford signed baseball cards, balls, posters, caps, mitts for a throng of fans. He wore his wildly curling black hair in a high short tail and an easy, cheerful smile on his carved out of polished granite face. His rangy body showed off well in black baggies and a thin snow white sweater. Eve could admit to feeling a little tug. So does that mean like she’s like, oh, I’m a little attracted here? I would say.

00:50:15 Speaker 3: You’re allowed to find people attractive, Eve.

00:50:17 Tara: Yeah. It says she could admit to feeling a little tug. She considered him a true artist on a field and a magician at the plate. But tug or not, he was at the moment a suspect. And that this is not the only time when she’s talking to him or when they’re here. She and Peabody that she kind of in her head thinks about, like she has this little tug. There’s something about this guy that kind of does it for her.

00:50:42 Speaker 4: I love it.

00:50:45 Speaker 3: I love that. I just love that. So yeah. So that’s in chapter twelve. Um, when Peabody digs into his past and his past is very dark. Yeah. Um, so Mars is blackmailing him over childhood sexual abuse? Um, and he’d been paying her for two years to keep it quiet. So Eve is disgusted. We’re all disgusted. Everyone is disgusted. Um, obviously not at Wiley, but at Mars. Total lack of empathy because she’s terrible. Um, so his friend and manager confirms everything, and Eve tells him that Mars didn’t deserve to die, but she definitely deserved a cage. And Peabody asked what Eve would have done in his place, and Eve admits she wouldn’t have let herself be victimized again. The badge gave her purpose, and betraying that was not an option. Peabody gently reminds Eve that killing her father wasn’t murder, it was survival. So what I like about, Um, I know people will be like, oh my God, I’m tired of hearing about your childhood. What I like about.

00:51:49 Tara: Yes, they absolutely.

00:51:50 Speaker 3: This one is. Yeah. Is like, this is this is not where we are. You know, as far as the the new books, we are we are in a completely different time in Eve’s life at that point. Now we’re at least like a year and a half from now or something, but like, it’s not going to go away. It’s not ever going to go away entirely. And it’s going to linger there. And like I appreciate every time Nora doesn’t hide from it and goes, this is an appropriate time for us to to make sure that the reading, like the reader, is still with Eve on this journey, you know, and so I just, I don’t know, like this. The thing about Wiley was really just very much like Eve Seeing someone like moments ago. You know, she’s like this big, strong, you know, attractive athlete. Like, thinking of him in that light was probably really effective for her. I don’t know. Yeah. Um, and of course, we always love when when Mira or Peabody or Roark are like, no, you literally didn’t murder your father. You you are here because you protected yourself.

00:53:09 Tara: Right, exactly.

00:53:11 Speaker 3: And I think she, you know, and Eve does. She’s gonna fall back into that place from time to time because you don’t just go, oh, I was told that this traumatic experience that I had, I’m okay now, so it’s never going to bother me again. Like, that’s not how it works.

00:53:27 Tara: Right. It’s not how that works.

00:53:29 Speaker 4: Yeah.

00:53:30 Speaker 3: You’re thirty years old. You should be over it.

00:53:34 Tara: Not how that works.

00:53:36 Speaker 3: It’s been a minute since we talked about that one.

00:53:38 Tara: Yeah.

00:53:40 Speaker 3: So the next stop is, um, another really lovely person, um, is Annie Knight, who Mars is also blackmailing. On the way. And on the way, Eve catches a purse snatcher, so that’s fun. Um, she loves that shit. And she needs a would be hero who gets in the way. Oh, yeah, the guy who’s like, no police brutality. Like trying to, you know, like, falls for the. And he’s like, ah, just again. Stop. Don’t worry about it. Just get over there. Anyway. But that’s the highlight of his day. Clearly she gets to catch.

00:54:17 Tara: A.

00:54:18 Speaker 3: Person. A person ever. So, um. So anyway, so when Annie finally agrees to talk with Eve, her story is rough. As a teen, she killed a man in self-defense while her biological mother, a prostitute, tried to pimp her out. Mars found out decades later and milked her for almost two years. and he planned to go to the cops just before Mars was killed. And Eve promises to verify everything, but basically tells Annie that defending herself at thirteen doesn’t make her a criminal. It’s a rare soft moment for Eve, and a reminder that Ma’s death, while gruesome and did a lot of people’s nightmares and again continues with more of Eve having to sit in that nightmarish place.

00:54:59 Tara: Yeah, this is saying chapter thirteen says their next stop is actress Annie Night. Well, their first stop, because I was looking at chapter thirteen and their first stop is Missee Lee durante.

00:55:15 Speaker 3: Oh, that’s right, Miss Ellie. Don’t they go? And then she’s like, I’ll meet you later.

00:55:20 Tara: Yeah. So, um.

00:55:22 Speaker 3: So then she like, talks to her later, but she goes to talk to her and they’re like, no, trying to protect her or whatever. And she’s like, I need to, I will, I promise you, I’ll talk to you later.

00:55:33 Tara: Right.

00:55:34 Speaker 3: That’s all I remember from that.

00:55:35 Tara: Yeah, but what I really liked about this scene, though, was, you know, it’s talking about them being on the scene and obviously, you know, they’re filming the show and it’s saying that, um, you know, they’re watching the filming and this actress is like saying Missee Lee durante, a pink and white polka dotted backpack over her fashionable purple coat, raced cheerfully by on pink airboats. Her colorful scarf flew out like ribbons. The pompoms on her hat bounced madly. She fumbled with the latch of a little courtyard gate, burst through it, then ran toward the door of a tidy brick townhouse. And it says, I bet that jerk Tad dumped her, Peabody muttered. And he’s like, what? Just thinking why she’s crying. See, Tad’s the high school football quarterback, and he’s been crushing on Eve that she’s been crushing on, even though he’s a shitbag under it and he’s been playing her. So she do his assignments. but Peabody trailed off when Eve simply held her under a cool, cool stare. Anyway, so you know.

00:56:44 Speaker 3: Peabody, you watch whatever you want to on TV.

00:56:47 Tara: Right? You know.

00:56:50 Speaker 3: Good for you. But watch whatever the hell you want.

00:56:53 Tara: And I’m sure.

00:56:54 Speaker 3: He.

00:56:54 Tara: Thinks the same thing, but it’s the fact that she’s talking about it. Like, I bet that that jerk Tad dumped her like she was funny.

00:57:03 Speaker 3: I love I laughed out loud. Yeah. The first time I like, I was like, uh, Peabody? The jerk. Tad. Also, his name is Tad. He’s gonna fucking suck. Sorry.

00:57:17 Tara: Right. And then.

00:57:18 Speaker 3: After.

00:57:19 Tara: And after Missy says right. And then after Missy says, like, I’ll see you later. They’re about to leave. And it says she held out. A hand shook. Eve shook Peabody’s. Uh, it’s Tad, right, Missy? Lee left a quick, infectious, infectious gurgle. Yeah, he dumped me with mega humiliation. He’s a prick. He really is. I gotta go. It’s. So, I mean, I love that for Peabody, but it’s just so funny.

00:57:52 Speaker 3: It’s so funny, so fun. Just fun stuff. Yeah. And so the next chapter. Um, fourteen. Yes. Okay. Um, so Eve is not done poking around any Knights world yet. Her pushy assistant, Bill Hyatt rubs her the wrong way. Done done done. Too defensive, too eager to control access. After Eve leaves Knight Productions, she calls the Saint Louis cops about Annie’s old case with the local detective as a jerk and blows her off. Eve responds with classic Dallas energy. Send me the file in two hours or I’m going over your head. Um, and sorry, before we go on. Bill Hiatt was also a. Yes. Spoiler. He’s he’s our guy. Um, but he’s an idiot. Like what?

00:58:47 Tara: Yeah.

00:58:48 Speaker 3: Like bad guy one hundred and one. Do not make a fucking scene.

00:58:53 Tara: Oh, yeah. Not with Eve.

00:58:56 Speaker 3: Like. Come on. Jeez. If you’re gonna bad guy, do it at least slightly competently. Anyway, so then, um, also, Roarke pops in. After that, he casually confirms that. Yep, Mars had another secret place. Eve is still wrestling with the idea of evil. Mars wasn’t a murderer, but she destroyed people’s lives for fun. Roarke reminds her that even if the world reminds her that even if the world’s grey Eve is still the line that holds, it’s actually kind of sweet. It’s actually one of Eve’s interesting floors. I don’t know that it’s sweet, but that’s my feeling about that. But it does help make Eve be a very interesting character, right?

00:59:41 Tara: Isn’t it?

00:59:42 Speaker 3: Yeah. Uh, what Roark says is sweet.

00:59:47 Tara: Um, yeah. Because he says, um, I have to at least half admire her style. Not evil, but the potential is always there, depending on circumstance.

00:59:59 Speaker 3: Uh, not evil, but potential’s there.

01:00:02 Tara: Uh, you could have turned evil to me, to the potential’s there, she said as she shifted to look at him again. That may be while I’ve done my share of in cold blood and more than my share of deeds. The cop in you may understand and will never approve of. And still I’ve looked at myself before and after you, and come to realize that as lost as I was before you, There were lines I couldn’t and wouldn’t cross. And you, Lieutenant? He studied her as she did him. You. Your lines are and have always been closer and deeper than mine. There’s mean in you. Just another one of the countless reasons I adore you. But your potential for evil. And I agree. That’s in all of us is far, far outweighed by your absolute dedication to protecting and serving not just the people, but that amorphous goal of justice. It is sweet.

01:01:04 Speaker 3: Yeah, what he says is sweet.

01:01:07 Tara: Chapter fifteen. Eve heads to Nadine’s place, where Nadine’s found another victim of Mars. Of Mars schemes. Uh, Phoebe Michaelson, who turns out to be the daughter of Blackhat. Derek, a legendary hacker turned terrorist. And Roarke knows him because right away, Roarke is like blackhat. Derek.

01:01:25 Speaker 3: Wow.

01:01:27 Tara: Yeah. and knows the whole story. It tells them the whole story of what this guy did. Mars discovered Phoebe’s real identity and forced her to hack for her, threatening to expose her and her mom. Phoebe’s terrified, but already, but ready to quit her job and disappear again. Eve’s disgusted, but impressed. Mars had a talent for sniffing out secrets like a bloodhound from hell. Roarke helps Eve track Mars’s other properties, and they visit Missy Lea Durante, another of Mars targets. Mars has been blackmailing her over her sister’s paternity, threatening to blow up her family if she didn’t pay up. Same pattern, same ugliness.

01:02:10 Speaker 3: This woman was such a bitch.

01:02:12 Tara: She was a bitch. Or is a bitch was a bitch. Um, so the one thing that obviously it doesn’t mention here is that they go to Nadine’s apartment, and this is her new apartment. She’s just moved in.

01:02:25 Speaker 4: Mhm.

01:02:26 Tara: And um they go in there and it’s the first time they’ve seen it since she’s moved in. And uh they’re looking around and you know everything looks great. And uh, Nadine is saying um, I love living here more and more every day. I’m still finding pieces. Um, that’s half the fun. But it’s already home. And Roarke says Eve’s right. It suits you. Bold colors, strong art, a zillion to Eve’s. I fancy pillows bunched together over sofas. That was probably an artistic way. What is that? Eve pointed. It’s a table. It’s a dragon table. A blue glass dragon. I don’t know why I fell in love with it, but I did. It’s charming. Roarke crossed to it, admired the sinuous body, the gleaming shades of blue dome. Yes. If you think it’s dumb, why did you buy it? Dome corrected Eve with a laugh. Gorgeous craftsmanship. I’m enjoying finding interesting art and furnishings. I never knew I’d enjoy it as much as I do. And still, it’s really all about that. Uh. She gestured to the window of glass and the city lights glittering behind it, that at least Eve could appreciate when she had the time. We’ve got seven o’clock uptown, so give me what you got. Um, then you’ve got time for a glass of wine while I do. I’m on duty. I’m not. Roarke put in, and I’d love one. And Nadine says, have a seat. One minute. She moved off. Eve remembered the dining room, huge red table and the kitchen. Sleek and loaded. Roarke sat, Eve paced. She’ll have a party soon, I imagine, he commented. Now I’ve seen how she’s filling out her space. I have an idea where to find her. A housewarming gift. The thought of another party. Another gift. Had Eve casting her eyes to the ceiling. It never, just never ended. So.

01:04:28 Speaker 3: Oh, Eve. Also, can we talk about how I want the dragon table? Who doesn’t want that dragon? Sounds amazing. Amazing. Yeah, it sounds so cool, Eve. The fact that Eve didn’t go. I want that dragon table. Yes. Of course she wouldn’t, you know.

01:04:48 Tara: I mean, it’s not really Eve’s style. I don’t think.

01:04:52 Speaker 3: It’s. No, she doesn’t have. She doesn’t give a shit. If Roarke were to put a dragon table in her house, she’d be like, okay. Like.

01:05:01 Tara: I mean, she might comment on it, but.

01:05:03 Speaker 3: She would comment.

01:05:04 Tara: On it, but.

01:05:04 Speaker 3: She would.

01:05:04 Tara: Be like.

01:05:06 Speaker 3: No, but we don’t. We don’t trust Eve to pick. So, I mean, what.

01:05:13 Tara: Do you think? She’s picking a house? I don’t think she’s picked anything.

01:05:16 Speaker 3: Not a single thing. And you know, and you know that everything that she had in that old, tiny apartment that Mavis moved into was like very, very basic. Like bare minimum. Not not cheap. I think that she was like, okay, but I have to, like, have this for a long time because.

01:05:36 Tara: Right.

01:05:36 Speaker 3: You know. Um, but I don’t think it was never anything fancy or anything that was unique. She was like, okay, basic brown dresser. Okay. Basic end table. Like nothing. No art on the wall. She was like, I sleep here like that. Would that I feel like is easy. So she’s never she’s never helping work with any of this.

01:05:58 Tara: No.

01:05:59 Speaker 3: That’s why I love that she that she buys that painting in the future. In one of the future books. What book is that? Yeah.

01:06:07 Tara: And you, you did get an idea in that book that that was like one the one time or one of the first times that that has happened to Eve where she’s seeing a piece of art or something. I don’t know if you would call it frivolous, but something frivolous like that. And went. That really speaks to me. Yeah. Even though she couldn’t articulate why.

01:06:27 Speaker 3: Yeah, that’s not because that’s not normally her thing. Whereas meanwhile, I’m over here being like, I, I absolutely am like, oh my God, I like this thing. That right has no business being in my space.

01:06:38 Tara: But and I’m like, it’s it’s not as though it didn’t speak to her. It spoke to her. And she understood why it spoke to her. Because, you know, it. It represented a place that had some special meaning to her. It’s that even even if in the past or now, something she finds speaks to her like that, it’s, it’s it’s that she never would have thought to buy it for herself.

01:07:07 Speaker 3: Yes.

01:07:08 Tara: Yeah, that speaks to me. So I’m going to buy it.

01:07:11 Speaker 3: Yeah. No. And and she like. Exactly. She would not have, she would have still like recognized it as something that gave her a positive feeling and like you said, speaks to her. But she wouldn’t also be like, And I’m going to have that as part of my.

01:07:30 Tara: Right.

01:07:30 Speaker 3: Apartment or whatever.

01:07:31 Tara: That part still doesn’t occur to her.

01:07:34 Speaker 3: No. Which is why when she does things like this is just. But that’s just how Eve is. She’s like, when this happens, it’s a specific circumstance where she, you know and sees the sees this piece that she purchases and she just makes that decision, like immediately, obviously. Like she also works around the fact that we are dealing with memorials and the death of this, of this girl. But like Eve does everything just with a purpose. She does not take time to make decisions. She makes decisions. She sinks through them, but she never goes. Mm. Maybe this, maybe this. The word maybe doesn’t exist in Eve’s life. It’s like when she shops, she walks up to the I want this like this is just how Eve is so right. But it’s so cool because like, she now can play into that, that part of her and recognize that instinctually she’s also allowed to want that.

01:08:31 Tara: Yeah.

01:08:31 Speaker 3: Instead of just recognizing that, it’s great. So yay Eve. Good for you.

01:08:36 Tara: Growth.

01:08:38 Speaker 3: Yay!

01:08:40 Tara: Yay for growth. Um, okay, so we’re on chapter sixteen. Sixteen it believes Missee Lee, but she’s sure that it’s not one of the victims who killed Mars. It’s someone connected to one of them. Back home, she and Roarke settle in for dinner and a snowstorm, and we get some heartwarming backstory about both of their rough childhoods. Was it heartwarming, though? Was it heartwarming? Was it heartwarming?

01:09:15 Speaker 3: Heartwarming. Not the right word.

01:09:17 Tara: And, you know, first of all, before we go on, um, I’ve been listening to the, uh, the book of the audiobook. Did you listen to the audiobook? Because that’s usually how you.

01:09:29 Speaker 3: I did.

01:09:30 Tara: Yeah. Okay. The way that Susan does. Phoebe really made me feel for her. I mean, it’s not like I wouldn’t have felt for her anyway.

01:09:41 Speaker 3: Yeah. It’s it’s hard because, you know, like, you have you have Eve’s reaction, negative reaction to, like, what Phoebe did helped Lorena’s terrible cause. But also like, Phoebe was. Phoebe was being blackmailed, too, you know?

01:10:00 Tara: Right.

01:10:01 Speaker 3: And like, it was like. But yeah, I think I really do think that Susan did a beautiful job with her.

01:10:07 Tara: Yeah.

01:10:08 Speaker 3: And she was, like, so young, too.

01:10:10 Tara: Right. And I kept waiting for Roarke to say, no, no, don’t go back to your hometown and do like, you know, work with your mother. Yeah, come work for me. But he never said it, so I was very. I was kind of disappointed. Um, you.

01:10:28 Speaker 3: Probably recognize that’s what she needed.

01:10:31 Tara: Yeah.

01:10:32 Speaker 3: Blah, blah, I guess.

01:10:36 Tara: Um. So hang on a second. I’m trying to get to the heartwarming, uh, part where even talk about their childhoods, which wasn’t heartwarming.

01:10:48 Speaker 3: I was like, what?

01:10:54 Tara: Uh, okay. So Roarke admits Somerset tried to teach him how to cook and failed. And Eve shares. Shares a charming story about almost failing life science because she couldn’t make fake scrambled eggs. It’s a rare, cozy moment until Eve starts thinking about Annie’s case and realizes Mars knew Annie wasn’t guilty, but milked her anyway. She was such a bitch. Yeah. The more Eve sees of this case, the more she realizes Mars just didn’t just dig up dirt. She weaponized trauma. That is a truth. If we’re talking about.

01:11:31 Speaker 3: That is a truth.

01:11:32 Tara: That if we’re talking about this book being about truth, that is a truth.

01:11:37 Speaker 3: And unfortunately, a thing that people do.

01:11:40 Tara: Um, they’re talking about Wylie Sanford and that, uh, the guy that had, uh, had essayed Wylie ended up dead in an alleyway, like, beaten to death. And they didn’t. I don’t think they found who did it. I think it was like the police never found him.

01:12:02 Speaker 3: I don’t think they did either.

01:12:04 Tara: That, you know, mirrors a little bit of Roarks and Eves, you know, childhoods. Eve says that, um, she kind of thinks she knows who did it. And Rorke says, will you push on that? She stood paced rock hard place. It’s my job. But I tell myself it’s not my my case. I can take the straight arrow line and start peeling things back, and the man I’d peel things back on has two more kids, has worked at the same company for thirty years, volunteers at a youth crisis center. He started there six months after the the fucks death. He also coaches Little League team. He, if you’re right, would have been protecting his son. He should have gone to the cops. Who knows how the boy would have reacted? Who knows if he’d been believed, what would it serve? After all these years? We both know what it is to be abused as a child. For me it was neglect or beatings. But you and that boy have more in common. Somerset saved me. Work continued more passionately than he’d intended, and someone did me the favor of putting a knife in Patrick Roark, as he’d have found me likely done for me sooner or later. Eve slid her hands into her pockets, looked away, walked to the window to look out. She didn’t respond, just stared out the window. You saved yourself, Roark continued. We don’t know what it is to have a child, but we know what it is to be one. What wouldn’t we do, either of us, to protect what we loved and cherished? Then, just a few paragraphs later. Eve’s thinking she disappointed him. She could see it and she still felt herself torn. She had a duty, and yet she believed she knew who’d killed a man or a monster disguised as a man, just as she knew who’d killed Patrick Roark. So, um, it’s something where Roark is kind of like. obviously suspecting that Eve is keeping something from him.

01:14:13 Speaker 3: Yeah.

01:14:13 Tara: You know, just by how she reacted to that.

01:14:17 Speaker 3: Which is not heartfelt AI.

01:14:20 Tara: Which is not heartfelt. I mean, the whole thing was heartfelt. Like we it’s not it’s it’s a hard discussion to have though. It’s not like it’s heartfelt and like. Well, you know what I’m saying? Um, none of this is going to go inside of a, you know, hallmark card, but, um, you know, but I think the bigger thing here or the thing that we need to note, is that in that conversation, Eve didn’t answer him. When he talks about somebody killing Patrick Roarke, Eve turned away. Um, and I think it’s because she knows that Roarke can see like, through her, which he can. And if she were to just stand there and like, be a part of that conversation and look him in the eye. He would he would know the truth. And she feels like it’s not her truth to tell.

01:15:15 Speaker 3: Which is. Yeah.

01:15:18 Tara: And which goes to the theme of truth. Then I think the next part of this is just Eve has a nightmare featuring her father, Roarke’s father, and Mars, altogether a trifecta of awful Mars tonsor accusing Eve of protecting murderers and living in the gray herself. It’s creepy. And the Eve wakes shaken, wondering if she’s any better than the people she lets walk. So chapter eighteen, which is what you’re going to read right now, is the resolution of what happened between Eve and that we just now talked about.

01:15:56 Speaker 3: Yes. Which I had forgotten. This happened in this book. B.t.w. Um, I was like, I was like, oh, well, I mean, I yeah, I knew it happened at some point and I was like, oh, this is the book. This is where this happens. Okay, so now we’re at day three, Thursday chapter eighteen the Morning brings Clarity and breakfast with bacon thanks to Roarke. Turns out Roarke confronted Somerset, who finally admits he did kill Patrick Roarke years ago to protect young Roarke and Marlena Roarke. Surprisingly okay with it. More grateful than angry. And then Eve admits she always suspected but never told him. They both agree that justice isn’t always black and white. Somerset may have killed a monster, but he did it for the right reasons. It’s a heavy and oddly healing moment. So here it is from the book Somerset is making bread. Somerset continued to knead. Early tomorrow I’m entertaining myself by baking and cooking. You and the lieutenant won’t starve while I’m gone. Do you want coffee? Shaking his head, Roarke continued to wander, restless. You and I, We’ve evaded each other now and again over the years. That’s natural enough, isn’t it? Somerset turned the dough into a bowl, covered it with a cloth before walking, walking to the sink to wash his hands. What’s on your mind, boy? I don’t recall either of us lying outright to the other. Well, not since my beginnings with you when lying was my default. And you saw through that more than I thought. Then, though I may have slipped a few by you, I doubt it. Roarke smiled, leaning on the counter as Somerset dried his hands. Those were the days. And still after those raw beginnings, after trust and respect and affection, I don’t see either of us lying to the other if a question was asked straight and direct. What is your question? Did you kill Patrick Roarke? Somerset laid the dish towel aside and simply said yes. Ah well. On a nod, Roarke kept his eyes on Somerset. All this time you never said a word. For what purpose? You couldn’t think I would have cared, that I would have turned even an inch away from you for it. No. Not that. Somerset walked over to the breakfast area, sat waiting for Roark to join him. You were just a boy, beaten down and barely beginning to believe you could have a life without the fist. Why burden you? As time passed again. What purpose would there have been to tell you? I wondered when she would. The lieutenant’s scale was different than mine. No less right or wrong, just different measures. She didn’t tell me. Why did you tell her? And when? Obviously surprised, Somerset sat back. I may never get a true handle on your wife, boy. Not one that holds firm. I didn’t tell her. Not in so many words. She has a way of finding out, of interpreting and intuiting. I didn’t confirm or deny, but she knew it was when I fell down the stairs. When I was healing from breaking my own careless leg. I suppose I was a bit less guarded. Eve looked back to the accident, the aftermath, and wondered how he hadn’t seen considerable time for her as well to keep that secret from me. Somerset’s narrow shoulders stiffened. You won’t blame her for that, or you’ll disappoint me. How they protect each other, Roarke thought, though both would be appalled to have pointed to have it pointed out right. Yeah. So good, so good.

01:19:32 Tara: So, yeah, I mean, this.

01:19:33 Speaker 4: Clearly.

01:19:34 Tara: Speaks to the theme of, you know, truth or wanting truth or telling truths, essentially.

01:19:42 Speaker 3: I also just love how all of that came out, like it was no one. No one betrayed anyone’s trust, you know?

01:19:50 Tara: Right.

01:19:52 Speaker 3: Because those three characters never would.

01:19:56 Speaker 4: So.

01:19:56 Speaker 3: Right. Chapter nineteen Back to the murders. Back to. Back to the the the current day murders. As Patrick Burke was murdered. So chapter nineteen. Eve is ready to follow her gut. She and Peabody tracked down Ma’s secret second home, a duplex near DuPont. God damn it.

01:20:18 Tara: I know, right? She knows. Let’s just say it’s Gino’s.

01:20:24 Speaker 3: And they they don’t break in with a warrant. They they go in with a warrant. They don’t have to break in. They’re cops inside. It’s a museum of greed. Clothes, art, jewelry, even a vault. Roarke can’t resist the challenge and cracks it open in record time, uncovering hundreds of millions in cash, gems and stolen goods. Among the treasures are detailed male words among the treasures. It’s only Monday, guys. Um. Among the treasures are detailed blackmail scrapbooks on every mark she had, complete with photos, receipts and notes rating people from barely worth my time to prime cash cow. She even had files on Eve, Roark, Mavis and Leonardo. It’s gross, but impressive. Can we just say putting together a scrapbook is a ton of work? It really is a lot of work. What are you doing?

01:21:16 Tara: Yeah.

01:21:16 Speaker 3: Anyway.

01:21:17 Tara: Sitting amongst all of her stuff.

01:21:20 Speaker 3: Right. She’s like, oh, I’m here with all of my jewels. Let me get out my glue stick and make my scrapbook. About what? I’m going to blackmail Mavis.

01:21:27 Tara: Like.

01:21:30 Speaker 3: She’s got like. Like, I don’t know, I don’t know, just like she she has, like, her little craft supplies on her desk.

01:21:37 Tara: Right.

01:21:37 Speaker 3: Cutting out. Cutting out a picture of Leonardo, like.

01:21:41 Tara: That’s. Yeah, that’s just weird.

01:21:43 Speaker 3: So fucking weird. Anyway, Eve takes everything in a.

01:21:46 Tara: Bag for Eve because Eve sees the part. The. The one for her and Roarke. And there’s a picture of him with, um, you know, Magdalena.

01:21:56 Speaker 3: And he was.

01:21:56 Tara: Like, really obsessing about.

01:21:57 Speaker 3: It. Really? I know. It’s like just what I wanted to be reminded about. Yeah. Oh my God. Okay, so Eve takes everything in as evidence, already building her theory. Whoever killed Lorinda Mars didn’t just want revenge. They wanted her stopped. I mean, that’s the same thing, right? You don’t get revenge on a person hurting you. And then just be like, keep doing the thing you’re doing that hurts people.

01:22:22 Tara: Right?

01:22:24 Speaker 3: AI is winning today, guys. Chapter twenty.

01:22:28 Tara: Now we’re on to chapter twenty.

01:22:30 Speaker 3: So chapter twenty. Mira helps Eve profile the killer, which she’s been doing this whole book. This is the first time this outline mentioned her, right? The murder was clean, deliberate and symbolic, cutting Mars arteries. So she literally bled out like the people she bled dry. The killers likely educated, disciplined and controlled. Not some random rage case. Meanwhile, Nadine swings by with doughnuts and donuts and gossip, which sounds fun as hell. Um.

01:22:59 Tara: Of course it does.

01:23:00 Speaker 3: Eve shares what she’s found, including Mars second home and her insane collection of evidence. Nadine’s both horrified and fascinated. Eve is pretty sure the killer isn’t one of the blackmail victims, but someone close to them. Someone who thought they were doing the right thing. I mean, yes, but also, did he think he was doing the right thing? He wanted to do what he wanted to do.

01:23:21 Tara: Right? I mean, he probably did. He probably thought he was doing it.

01:23:26 Speaker 3: That guy sucked. I mean, yeah, so that guy sucked. I didn’t like him before. I knew he was a killer. Yeah, he didn’t like him either.

01:23:34 Tara: Yeah. Um, okay. Chapter twenty one. Eve brings her boxes of evidence home, ready to dive in after some quality rawk time, of course. Between kisses and pasta, she sorts through Mars’s ledgers and ratings. Noticing patterns. Mars rewarded snitches and punished people who defied her. Um. Baxter calls Mid-meal with breaking news. Another murder. A woman who worked for Annie Knight Productions was stabbed and bled out exactly the same way as Mars Eve’s. Gut reaction. The killer just slipped up. Uh, chapter twenty two. Even Peabody rushed to the new scene and realized the killer is Bill Hyatt and his assistant. He killed Mars to protect Annie when then murdered a coworker to cover his tracks. When Eve arrests him, he confesses everything. How Mars mocked him. How he thought he was saving Annie. How killing Mars made him feel like a hero. Eve tells him flat out Annie won’t thank him. She’ll be sickened by what he did. He doesn’t get. He doesn’t get it, of course, and Eve leaves him to the uniforms with the case finally closed, Peabody and McNab head to Mexico, and even Roarke go home for wine. And not just a bad movie. What did she say? A, um, after I make the tags and write this up, let’s crack a bottle of wine and watch a vid. Something funny. Like stupid. Funny. Something ridiculous. And you know what? I think they watched Tara.

01:25:19 Speaker 3: Well, no. What do you think?

01:25:21 Tara: They watched Bill and Ted’s Excellent Adventure?

01:25:25 Speaker 3: Okay, I don’t know that either. I don’t think I don’t know if that’s Eves humor.

01:25:32 Tara: She wants something funny, something stupid, funny? Something ridiculous. What?

01:25:38 Speaker 3: But I don’t.

01:25:40 Tara: That’s exactly you’re. You’re describing Bill and Ted’s Excellent Adventure.

01:25:44 Speaker 3: That’s fair. I would say that definitely. That more than something like, um. Uh, I can’t even think of it now. Um, stepbrothers or anything like that?

01:25:58 Tara: Yeah, or even, like Princess Bride, even though I think it’s overrated. Um, but Princess Bride is more. It’s not stupid funny. It’s ridiculous.

01:26:11 Speaker 3: It is ridiculous.

01:26:12 Tara: Um, but like. But there is some kind of a smart humor to it.

01:26:17 Speaker 3: Oh, yeah.

01:26:18 Tara: And it’s kind of the same as as, like, Spinal Tap or something like that. Um.

01:26:25 Speaker 3: Do you think Roarke has made Eve watch Spinal Tap?

01:26:28 Tara: I don’t know.

01:26:30 Speaker 3: I don’t know, watch Spinal Tap.

01:26:32 Tara: Of course. It’s classic.

01:26:34 Speaker 3: I think he would. I mean, yeah, we know, we know he’s watched Spinal Tap.

01:26:39 Tara: Right. Um, but if you’re saying I want something stupid, funny, like something ridiculous, I mean, there’s a lot of movies that come to mind.

01:26:50 Speaker 3: Yeah.

01:26:50 Tara: Since we already talked about how Bill and Ted.

01:26:53 Speaker 3: We did talk about Bill and Ted.

01:26:54 Tara: Yeah, stupid, funny and ridiculous. I think he would have. Would, you know, if that’s what she’s in the mood for. I think Eve would appreciate.

01:27:03 Speaker 3: What she’s in the mood for. She’d be in for it. If that is not what she’s in the mood for. And, like, raw could be like, this is what I want to watch tonight. She’d be like, what? No. Where are the explosions?

01:27:14 Tara: Yeah, that’s not what she wants. She wants something funny.

01:27:16 Speaker 3: Like she wants stupid funny. She wants stupid funny.

01:27:20 Tara: She doesn’t want explosions. There are nights when she says I want something with explosions. She.

01:27:25 Speaker 3: She loves explosions. She loves explosions in movies.

01:27:28 Tara: It’s just not what she wanted.

01:27:30 Speaker 3: Not what she wanted tonight.

01:27:31 Tara: Because they are. This is a heavy case.

01:27:34 Speaker 3: It is. And honestly, like, she’s a murder cop. So I feel like most of her cases, even though they don’t feel as heavy to us as the readers, like some of the cases, we’re like, this is a filler book. This is a lighter case. There was murder, There was murder. People. Someone died. Someone had to experience a loss of a loved one. Like or likely, you know, every now and again, you find someone that no one fucking liked at all, not even their mom. But like Eve coming out of any, any murder case, being like, well, I’m in the mood for, you know, like, I don’t know, like Eve not wanting something that’s going to lighten her mood, whatever the hell she’s in the mood for, because clearly, sometimes it’s explosions. Yeah, like all of them are. All of them should be heavy in some way. We’re just not going to feel it because we’re not the ones running that case. Right. I would be concerned if Eve would be like, yep, that murder case wasn’t traumatizing at all. I didn’t care.

01:28:34 Tara: I’m sure they’re all a bit traumatizing, but.

01:28:37 Speaker 3: They’re all, yeah, I feel like they all have some. They all make her feel some kind of way.

01:28:42 Tara: But there’s some that are more traumatizing than others, and you can kind of understand why she would, at the end of it, go like, I want to watch a movie, but nothing heavy, you know? So I don’t want to watch people killing each other and blood spurting everywhere and like, you know.

01:29:02 Speaker 3: Right.

01:29:03 Tara: Good idea. Something stupid.

01:29:04 Speaker 3: To not watch that I would like.

01:29:06 Tara: To watch. Something stupid. Funny. Excellent adventure. Anyway. So yeah, that’s the end of the.

01:29:11 Speaker 3: So that’s the book.

01:29:12 Tara: That’s the.

01:29:13 Speaker 3: Book I did, I liked.

01:29:14 Tara: It.

01:29:14 Speaker 3: I liked it more than I remembered liking it. I don’t know that I ever was like, I didn’t like this book. I just was like, I didn’t remember it.

01:29:21 Tara: Well, it was one of those books that. Yeah, um, it was in a place where, um, I wasn’t necessarily rereading like I had done before. So I probably read it once and maybe twice, depending. And then it’s been years since I picked it up and read it again.

01:29:44 Speaker 3: So yeah, I could not tell you I read it. Yeah, I think I’ve read it twice now. Three times. Well, Susan, read it to me.

01:29:53 Tara: Yeah. Um, okay. So having said that, what are our commendations?

01:30:00 Speaker 3: I, I’m going to give one to Peabody for looking out for McNab. Um, I this is not me being critical of Peabody at all as as a character. Because, you know, I love her. Um, the series Peabody is a more. She’s not a main character, but she, you know, like, she’s closer to a main character than McNab is. And I feel like sometimes their relationship very much revolves around her. Um, probably because McNab was the pursuer, but I love. I mean, not always. Obviously, purity and death happened, but, like, I love how she just It is so comfortable with Eve and loves him so much that she shares this worry with her and she like, I don’t know, I just I really liked the little bit of domesticity between the two of them, and I just thought she was so sweet. And she also, you know, did her job and kicked ass at it while still caring for McNab, which is essentially what she did in purity, too. Um, in a different way. So, I don’t know. I just really thought it was very lovely. And I’m like, I kind of want to give her that little recognition.

01:31:14 Tara: Yeah, well, I mean, I, I really want to go with Roarke. I hate to go with Roarke because, you know, he’s like an MVP in every book, but he really was an MVP in this book. It was a.

01:31:27 Speaker 3: Really good book for Roarke.

01:31:29 Tara: Yeah, and not just like, you know, he did the things that he normally does, like look into the finances and all that stuff, but just the amount of and he does this every book too. But I don’t know. There’s just a different quality of it in this book. Like the amount of, um, uh, him supporting Eve mentally.

01:31:52 Speaker 3: Yes. And the other thing, because I just want to tack on to that for you. When when he shares about Lorinda trying like her attempt at, like, you know, kind of like feeling him out as a possible blackmail. Like how. And this is, this is an Eve and Roarke thing. It’s not just Roarke, but, like, how much their relationship has matured, that he can say that to Eve without her fucking flipping out. Um, not that Roarke does not have flip out moments post this book. But anyway, um, but also like, because of how he handled that and how he handled sharing that information with Eve, I was like, this is this is the Roarke that is so odd on like, the same fucking level and wave as Eve. One hundred percent through this whole book, like in a different book, Eve would be feeling a different kind of way about work sharing this information, but he just did it one hundred percent right in that moment. And I just, I don’t know, I really love those moments where you’re like, they are so in sync. And it’s not it’s not like to feel it’s not conveniently in sync, like sometimes it is. It was in sync and it.

01:33:07 Tara: Was.

01:33:08 Speaker 3: Very true to their characters. And yeah, I thought he was fucking great in this book.

01:33:13 Tara: Yeah, he really was.

01:33:14 Speaker 3: And his and his instincts about Somerset and being able to like, have that closure.

01:33:20 Tara: Right.

01:33:21 Speaker 3: Big fan I don’t know I.

01:33:24 Tara: Is he an instinct about Somerset and about Eve knowing about Somerset.

01:33:28 Speaker 3: And about Eve knowing. Yeah.

01:33:30 Tara: Yeah. And um, the one thing I didn’t mention when we talked about that was just that line of Somerset saying, you know, in terms of what the theme is. Him saying, I’ll never have a true read on your wife.

01:33:45 Speaker 3: Yeah.

01:33:46 Tara: And, you know, it’s partially because of his own biases, because he’s not a dummy either. And he reads people well. So he he by this time he should have a read on her. But because of his own biases, he doesn’t, you know.

01:34:08 Speaker 3: Yeah.

01:34:09 Tara: Um, so that’s on him. So, um. So, yeah. Should we, uh, move on to podcast business then?

01:34:21 Speaker 3: Oh, yeah.

01:34:29 Tara: So do I have any podcasts? Well, we already talked about this, um, on the briefing room, but, um, Sally Mitchell is who I was thinking about in the briefing room. Sorry about that, Sally. Um, so Sally Mitchell had, uh, uh, posted on our Patreon about upcoming, um, calendars. If I was going to have a calendar again this year like I did last year in our merch store, and I am working on it right now, and the idea I have for the calendars is really a fun one. Um, and as Tara can attest to, because we went through the images that I’ve created for the calendar.

01:35:17 Speaker 3: This year, it so fun.

01:35:18 Tara: Yeah, it’s it’s really fun. So, uh, yes, I will be having, um, calendars in our merch store this year. Um, I just want to read a couple of maybe, um, uh, emails that we’ve gotten or comments. Yeah. So, uh, Elizabeth Hall has been going through. She’s a new listener. She’s been going through our older episodes. Um, and she says, I just listened to your third anniversary episode with Susan Erickson. I just want to let you know how amazing all your episodes are. But the ones with Susan Erickson are gold. They’re just really wonderful. Thanks, and keep up the great work. I just really love that.

01:36:02 Speaker 3: Um thank you comment there.

01:36:08 Tara: We just got a comment. Every once in a while I get a message that we got a comment on on, uh, Spotify.

01:36:15 Speaker 3: Okay. Those aren’t always easy to find.

01:36:20 Tara: They really aren’t. Yeah, it was a comment. Um, a couple weeks ago, somebody made on our, um, show on Apple Podcasts, and the comment is, um, has a title Can’t Stop and it says just started binge listening to this podcast. It’s my very first podcast ever because I was absolutely certain I would never enjoy listening to people just talk about nonsense. But now she does.

01:36:53 Speaker 3: Welcome, welcome to where we talk about nonsense. Right.

01:36:58 Tara: Um, you really want to hear us talk about nonsense? You should become a patron and listen to some of our briefing rooms. Um, but I digress. Um, but I’m so glad that I stumbled upon podcasts and death. I reread relisten to this series more than any other, because the characters are like family that I get to visit when I need comfort or to reduce anxiety. This show has given me so much joy to be able to hear other points of view about the books I love, and talk about things I have missed and review the reviews, Dear heavens, on those episodes I worry I might pee my pants. I’m laughing so hard. I’m pretty sure this review did not follow the rules of how to write a review. Sorry. The bottom line is this show is a must listen for fans of the in-depth world and Susan Erickson. Love, love, love her. So glad you had her on the show. Keep up the amazing job, ladies.

01:38:01 Speaker 3: Thank you.

01:38:03 Tara: Yeah, thanks. We really appreciate all the good reviews. Sometimes we even appreciate the bad reviews because it gives us something to talk about, complain about on the show.

01:38:16 Speaker 3: Yeah.

01:38:18 Tara: But for the most part, most of you that listen give us good reviews and we really, really, really appreciate that. I remember.

01:38:27 Speaker 3: You.

01:38:28 Tara: At a certain point telling this is horrible. I remember at a certain point when we first started, like our first year talking about the podcast to, I think, my older brother and his son, my nephew. Um, and they were asking like what the rating was. And at that point, I mean, we’ve pretty much stayed right around a four point eight, to be honest with you, which is pretty good for a podcast. Um, out of eighty six ratings. Um, so anyway, I was telling them, like, yeah, you know, we’re right around, we stay around, uh, four point eight, I think it was my nephew that was like, oh, that probably won’t last. And I was like, rude. Rude. Yeah, but it has. And we’ve stayed around four point eight, um, for five years. Granted, it’s only eighty six ratings. But look, you know, I have to, you know, think that even if we got more ratings than that, it was still stay at a four point eight.

01:39:28 Speaker 3: So I think we’re doing great.

01:39:30 Tara: Test my theory, radar show.

01:39:37 Speaker 3: So I love it.

01:39:41 Tara: Yeah. So, anyway, um, I guess that’s it. I don’t think I have anything.

01:39:46 Speaker 3: That’s great. That was fun.

01:39:48 Tara: Yeah. I really love it when people send us good, um, messages. Makes me happy. Um, so if you want to send us a good message, you can do so by going to any of our social medias. You can find us on Instagram and Facebook and blue Sky and TikTok. Um. What else? I don’t know what else, but just look for us for at Podcast and Death. If you want us on some other platform, you have to let us know. Um, look for podcast and death. We’re usually on, you know, most of the bigger platforms. Um, or if you want to send us a message, you can send us an email at show at podcast. Com um, or you can call our number and the number is two zero five four seven six two seven five three. Look at that, Tara. I did it again without looking.

01:40:41 Speaker 3: I’m so proud of you.

01:40:43 Tara: If I say it real fast like that, it comes out. If I hesitate and think about it, that’s when I blank. Um, but it’s two zero five four seven six two seven five three. And that spells out two zero five four Roarke. You can call us and leave a message. Uh, you can also text that number. Uh, but we love when people leave us messages on our number two. Um, and I guess that’s it. I don’t think we have a topic for next week’s episode, but we’ll find one.

01:41:15 Speaker 3: We’ll figure it out. We’ll figure it out.

01:41:17 Tara: Has suggested that we have Caitlin on again. She asks Tara questions. Yeah, because apparently I wasn’t, uh, you know, entertaining enough last week, and I thought you were great. Last week I listened to the episode. I mean, we had fun, so I hope you had fun. We might do that. We can come up with another. We have tons of ideas for episodes, right, Tara? We always have tons of ideas for episodes. Tons. Yeah, tons. Anyway, we’re making things work. Okay. Is it like. I feel like this episode, we were both kind of a little bit loopy or something, I don’t know. Yeah, this is just. This is. Well, this is my personality. So, um, you just noticed it this time? Oh, okay. Um, I think and it might just be that we haven’t recorded for a couple of weeks, so we were just kind of, like, happy to be recording again together. Um, anyway, so, yes, we will find, uh, another topic to discuss next week. So, um, until then, I guess that’s it for this episode of Podcast and death. So for, uh, podcast and death. This is AJ.

01:42:30 Speaker 5: This is Tara.

01:42:31 Tara: And we’ll see you next week, guys.

01:42:33 Speaker 5: Bye, guys.

01:42:35 Tara: Bye.